Your birth chart outcome change according to the place you live

different-nationalities.jpgYour birth chart outcome change according to the place you live, and also to the conditioning, which you acquired by your family and culture.

Writing astrological interpretations to fit the more than 100 countries represented by 12andus’ users is a big challenge because astrology interacts with the different cultures in unique ways.

For instance, let's take a person with a techno-creative Mercury in Virgo in the 9th house trine Uranus in Capricorn in the 5th house. This person would probably thrive in Silicon Valley but struggle to find a supportive environment for its potential in an undeveloped country, where, nonetheless, it might exert a creative role in his community.

In both cases, the symbols of pioneering, geniality, travel, a well-developed analytical mind, and perseverance would be present.

While the first person might create a disruptive software application for travelers by working day and night incessantly, the second person might patiently carve a more efficient canoe to bring his tribe through the Amazon River (or maybe using the invention to go for a date in another village since the 5th house is also involved :-)

As another example, a woman with Venus conjunct Mars in Scorpio living in a liberal country might realize those energies as a dominatrix, while a woman living in a very traditional country might become obsessed with a man who left to become a soldier in a war zone and she might want to reach him.

In both cases, obsessions, danger, intensity, and control are all symbolically present, but in very different modalities.

For this reason, at 12andus we prefer to talk in symbolical terms instead of talking about facts or events. Symbols are a sort of archetypal “seed-words” giving birth to concepts and actions according to the culture where such archetypes are rooted.

So we prefer, for instance, to talk about the 5th house as a symbol of creativity, which includes performing arts and pro-creativity, as in sexuality and parenthood, or about the Jupiterian symbol of “far” which encompasses the geographical far as in traveling, the intellectual far as in superior knowledge, and on the spiritual plane, the far/deep inner traveling toward self-knowledge.

If we consider symbols as seeds, we might say that the symbols are stable, like the seeds' DNA, but the seeds' outcomes, the trees, are different according to the soil and weather conditions. The same species of tree can thrive in certain conditions or suffer in others.

The problem is that when an astrologer talks in symbolical terms and asks the client for more information, it often creates misunderstandings. Talking in symbolical terms can be felt by the client as generic and even a tricky way to say something that fits all sizes.

To make things worse, when an astrologer asks the client for more background information, the latter might be surprised and think “shouldn't he/she be the one supposed to tell me about myself”?

An astrologer is not cheating when talks in symbolical terms or by asking more information to the client. Those further information help to frame the environment where the planetary symbolical energies take place.

Of course, there are also dishonest astrologers as there are dishonest plumbers, doctors or politician (probably the majority in the latter case).

Another difficulty is when an astrologer's client listens from the astrologer something which is part of his nature that is not accepted, recognized or acknowledged. Past familiar or cultural conditioning or the structures of the ego itself prevent the client from being aware of its own nature.

As an example, if the astrologer finds elements pointing to a sensual person, this might be negated by people whose cultures condemn such feelings, which in turn affects self-acceptance.

The ego, often in the form of conflictual aspects of the Sun, Mars or Saturn, also might become a barrier to acknowledging who we are. For instance, a Sun square Mars in a person might negate its dreamy and sensitive Neptune dominant by identifying its nature as a very active and competitive person. Then repressed Neptune gets its space by bringing intoxication every night.

Much of the astrologer's work is actually about helping the client first to acknowledge and then accept its very own unique traits.

See also:

Can artificial intelligence be applied to astrology?

The benefits of knowing our birth chart and traits

Astrology forecast without self-inquiry are pointless

Why we should finally stop with the Sun sign astrology

What to expect from an astrological reading

Astrology forecasts and astrologers don't know what will actually happen to you

Is our personality defined by the birth chart?

Human astrologers and 12andus' reports

What does your dominant planet say about you?

The difference between “signs” astrology and personalized astrology


More about: astrology birth chart


    • Xicotencatl Xayacate
      Xicotencatl Xayacate

      A very useful post, indeed! <3
      I'm not a professional astrologer, but it will help me to give better interpretations... <3

      Conflictual aspects of the sun, Mars and Saturn, uh? It explains a lot of things...
      But it affects me in a very different way. My dominant planet is Pluto and my dominant sign is Scorpio, but my Sun is in Cancer (ninth house... but I'd rather it were in Leo, in my tenth house), my Mars is in Virgo (tenth house too... but I'd rather it were in Scorpio, along with my first house's stellium) and my Saturn is in Aquarius (I prefer it were where it doesn't affect the rest of planets, in trine with something useful instead of making a cross with useful stuffs... Saturn gives one isses anywhere it's set). Then, my Saturn (the second most strong planet in my natal chart) is opposed to my Sun in Cancer and my Midheaven in Leo (Sun-conjunction-Midheaven, Sun-conjunction-Mercury, Mercury-conjunction-Midheaven and Mercury-conjunction-Jupiter), and it's squaring my ascendant in Scorpio and my descendant in Taurus off, and it's in conjunction with my IC in Aquarius. And Mars (my third most strong planet in my natal chart) is in conjunction with Venus, and they both are in trine with Uranus in Capricorn...

      It's said Pluto is related with sex, being authoritative and evil and freaking people out everywhere one goes (really, I hate this latter indeed, and I can't avoid it; I'm not a monster). It's also said that Scorpio is about the same, and also obsession, danger, problems, cruelty and a lot of things that also sound horrible. It's almost like talking about devils, succubi, harpies, sorcerers and so on. But I'm not that way. I'd be that way but when being really angry, really scared (or afraid of something) or really depressed (which happens often, putting aside my "problematic" Saturn and my hard real life (I'm Mexican, and that's just the beginning...), but anyways I know how to control it... to some extent) only. Saturn and the sun are somewhat, somehow "attacking" to each other (Cancer is Saturn's exile, whereas Aquarius is still considered Saturn's home by old-school astrologers) and affecting my Scorpio's stellium in a very "negative" way: I'm aloof, distant, cold-hearted, calculating, and I have a very "gloomy" but realistic point of view about life (I prefer saying I'm earth-anchored and realistic, but people don't think that way), and I tend to suffer from depressions easier and more often than anyone would bear...

      But I'm used to it and even I see it as a positive feature of me as it lets me to control Pluto's nature (depressions are the only exception) and those features given by the sun in Cancer. If I wouldn't control the Cancer's childish and naive nature given by my Sun (and, despite it happens rarely, it happens, and most of times it makes me to get embarrased and ashamed of myself), maybe I'd have commited suicide long ago as Cancer is not made to stand real life's hard events (I have been homeless, I have starved lots of times, I have been really poor, I have dangerous enemies throughout my country, I have never had friends in the real life... stuffs that Cancer-dominant or Moon-dominant people would never bear). Moreover, I think Saturn's "negative" influence, instead of destroying me (as it's usually taught and said by astrologers) it's somewhat, somehow making me stronger and more resilient and that's thanks to Pluto's and Scorpio's influence, which I don't consider "negative" bur rather complex and hard to use and explain (medicine can either heal or kill... Pluto and Scorpio are like medicine... along with the fact Scorpions and Pluto-dominant people are attracted to medical sciences). For example, I never cared me, when I was drawn by extreme povert at ages 7-9, walking about 3 miles (6 km) to go to the only library in my hometown in order to acquire knowledge beyond what I could get at school (the Mexican educational system is practically useless due to its flaws). I just wanted to overcome my situation (including my first depression), and I could canalize all my frustration and bitterness (being poor, almost homeless, with no friends, bullied at school, physically ugly is frustrating for children and even for adults) that way in order to reach sucess some day in the future, and leaving that sad episode of my life behind. Even Mom supported me and used to go with me to the library. Mom also taught me how to read and write at age 3, along with the basics of maths (and I learned quickly as I just wanted to be successful some day in the far future, and making my parents being proud of me... I always felt as if my physical appearance -skinny, nerdy and weak- and my "femme-like" personality disappoints Mom, and I just atempt to prove her I'm not the useless, spoiled and foolish guy she tells me I am; sometimes I just feel like as if I were disappointing the whole world, and most of times that makes me to get into deep depressions that I can't overcome easily). And, despite we tend to get moody with each other easily (her dominant sign is Taurus and her dominant planet is the Moon), and despite she treated me as an adult since I was four or five years old (she considered I was smart enough to deal with adult issues) and therefore she raised me in a very rude, rough and tough way (also according to the traditional Mexicand mindset, one must deserve some thing to get the thing and along with Dad, she considered she shouldn't spoil me anymore- I used to be pretty spoiled by her before turning six years old- and teaching me how the real life is, disregarding how hard, sad and disappointing it might be; I was becoming arrogant, rebel and proud), I still love her and she loves me (in her "odd", particular way to do it), and that's another thing that Cancer can't stand as it's related with the mother, nourishment and nurturing. I prefer to think Mom's influence, along with Saturn's influence, instead of making me bitter-hearted and resentful, helped me to face real life's daily issues. xD

      Saturn's "negative" influence also means an evil fate/destiny stopping me every time I want to become successful and I'm about to reach stability in my life. I'm almost in my 30's, and I can't get a diploma yet, but at least I have gotten a lot of knowledge and experience, enough to survive in this cruel and evil world (or at least in the cruel and evil country where I live). Sometimes I think "How have I been able to cope with dealing with all my life's disgraces?" If I had a "pure" Pluto or a "pure" Scorpio, without Saturn's "interference", maybe I'd be alcoholic, addict to drugs or addict to sex, resentful, rankorous, bitter-hearted and always attempting to destroy myself unconsciously (or even consciously), and always obsessed with how hard and unbearable my life is and blah, blah, blah. Sometimes, after considering all the life's issues I'm facing in a certain moment, I say (and most of times, crying desperated) "I must overcome it, I must overcome it! I don't want to remain as loser! I know I'm weak and worthless, but I must overcome it!". Besides, Mom always used to say during the hard moments of my childhood and teenage "If I were a prostitute and your father were another drunk unemployed loser like most of Mexicans, you shouldn't care it. You are yourself, different of us, and you have your own life to do and undo whatever you want. Decission is yours. Just don't blame us due to your wrong decissions, please" (My both parents are also aloof, distant, cold-hearted, calculating and land-anchored, like me; despite my parents got divorded, they never changed their attituded towards me, and even become more aloof and distand with me, like me, which became more aloof and distant with them and the rest of the world). A normal Scorpion just had gotten resentful and rankorous against life itself, after considering no one wants to help him/her. A normal Cancer would commit suicide or got nuts in a very outrageous way, unable to stand such a crude speech. I don't know how I did it, but I became immune to hard, crude speeches and events like that. The only disadvantage of this feature is the fact I don't know how to give advice to people in distress as my speech also became rude and cruel. xD

      Regarding Mars, I think it's "turned off": It's in conjunction with Venus, in Virgo and in trine with Uranus. The only issue Mars gives me is the fact I love thinking "outside the box" and innovating in every area I can either cause polemics or proving there are another points of view outside the "official canon". My anger is focused on another areas. I dislike when someone tells me I'm wrong when I'm not wrong and when someone tells me I'm useless when I'm useful and my work is better than the other ones made by other people. I also dislike when people defend senseless point of views just because they are brand-new and "against the official canon" when the reality is that it's just the same with another name but hidden by well hidden falacies or just another so-called "revolutionary" leftist stuff (people usually label me as "far-right-winged", "nazi" or "fascist" due to that). I also love sci-fi and retro-futurism (steampunk, dieselpunk and such), but I think technology must be fosuced in a different way, and even I love spreading my speech about that in order to help people realizing about how much damage causes putting cars or computers into areas they must not be, for example. I love studying but I hate going to school because I just dislike the points of view that doesn't make any sense, along with slow-learning people that can't understand the very basics of something (which is the usual situation in Mexico, where not even university's students can read continuously... it's as if most of Mexico suffered from dyslexia, but that's another story) and inept teachers that aren't able to explain their themes properly, disregarding how much "academically successful" he/she is. A normal "conflictual" Mars is just about aggressivity only. Mine is about fighting against senselessness, bias and absurd, non-logic prejudices. Besides, Mom also told me about senselessness: "Just remember Galileo and the Inquisition: Make the Inquisition-like academy to believe they are right, but spread the truth after getting the diploma. Then, they'll understand and believe in your words" (Mexican culture is also paper-based and paper-biased). If I were up to me, there would be a lot of things I'd correct or re-focus to areas that require it in order to help people how wrong their lives are, but always based on solid evidence, unable to refute or counterdict. But my own history alongside my intellectual struggle is another story. xD